March 31, 2007
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Say what you will about her…
…but I actually agree with Rosie O’Donnell on most of this. And people who’ve known me for years, would never believe I’d be saying that. But she’s right about the torture, and even Elizabeth knows it! Unfortunately she’s still got a big mouth and no tact, but I can’t criticize anyone with a big mouth! (Hello pot? It’s kettle. You’re black!) This is terribly sad though. (And if you’re really interested and have a couple of hours to spare LOL, read the IM below for an interesting conversation with my friend David from Germany!)
Here’s a conversation I was having on MSN messenger tonight with my friend David in Germany. David was born and raised in Germany, but his parents came to Germany from Korea, and he lives in what I would call a traditional Korean family, albeit in Germany. I met him through his younger brother Daniel when he was an exchange student here. David is extremely intelligent, and always a great person to have a conversation with or a debate. We started talking about the video I posted above, and here is our conversation. Keep in mind that English is not his first (or second) language, but he still probably speaks better than I do
When David and I were done talking his brother Daniel got up and IM’d me. Keep in mind that when David and I started chatting it was 7 AM in Germany and when we finished it was noon. Now it’s 5:30 AM here and I’m having a conversation with Daniel! Good thing it’s Friday! I do have to meet some friends for breakfast in a few hours though…oh well, I’ll wear sunglasses. I’m going to post some pictures from the last time they were here, at the bottom too. Night!Carey says: …stranger things have happened
Daewoo says: definitely, like Bush W. becoming president
Daewoo says: AND being re-elected
Carey says: that was a flook
Carey says: the first time he wasn’t elected
Carey says: and the 2nd time he stole the election
Daewoo says: well, modern democracy in its essence
Daewoo says: when you cant buy the votes, threaten or steal them
Carey says: hey, don’t go bashing America now…it’s still the best place in the world to live!
Carey says: I’m not even kidding either!!
Daewoo says: so, who do you wanna be the next president?
Carey says: John Edwards, all the way
Daewoo says: did he enter the race?
Carey says: Hillary’s a bitch and Obama is too black (for America) and too inexperienced
Daewoo says: But his chances are slim, correct?
Carey says: who’s to say? a lot can happen in a year and a half
Carey says: his wife may not even be alive than
Carey says: we can only pray it’s not Rudy Giuliani
Carey says: he’s the devil incarnate
Daewoo says: better than mccain?
Daewoo says: or worse?
Carey says: rudy?
Carey says: far worse
Carey says: McCain is just a washed up adulterous war hero, who will be dead in 5 years
Carey says: http://www.xanga.com/CareyGLY/580207110/john–elizabeth-edwards.html
Carey says: then read this one next: http://www.xanga.com/CareyGLY/563533475/americas-most-influential-export.html
Carey says: and quit bashing America!
Carey says: then this one: http://www.xanga.com/CareyGLY/578735398/ghosts-of-abu-ghraib.html
Carey says: and I want your book report on my desk by 9 AM (my time)
Carey says: the video is quite good on that one too…god love rosie O’Donnell
Carey says: Every citizen of the world should be informed
Daewoo says: by YOU!
Carey says: and my blog is a good place to start LOL
Daewoo says: The only place of course!
Carey winks:
Daewoo says: and, im not bashing America. not the people anyway. im bashing their policies
Daewoo says: but its not easy to separate
Carey says: they’re not “our” policies, they’re the policies of a corrupt administration that has an under 30% approval rating and was not elected by the majority of the people, by the people and for the people!
Carey says: the smart majority anyway
Carey says: just the right wing nutjobs, and Cheney’s corporate robber barons
Daewoo says: well, then even the smart majority has to bear the responsibility, the “stupid” majority impose on the American policy
Carey says: I disagree
Carey says: I bear no responsibility as a vocal opponent of this war
Daewoo says: not as a people. but as a nation/country.
Carey says: I guess this is a better conversation to have in person, because I disagree
Carey says: hold on, I will post something that states my position much better than I can convey on an IM
Daewoo says: sorry for even starting it. but somehow this always becomes an issue.
Carey says: lol
Carey says: just hang on
Carey says: ok, refresh the first page, and watch the video
Daewoo says: Oh boy, what have I done?
Carey says: incited me!
Carey says: You can also find it at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiIyI6ugmUM
Carey says: I agree with 100% she says….gives me goose bumps actually
Carey says: Can you tell I’m incited!
Daewoo says: ok watching video
Carey says: and incidentally, in some countries you couldn’t even say what she’s saying here on national television
Carey says: cool…I’ll wait…it’s good
Daewoo says: btw, reading your blog about American tv shows influence on the world
Carey says: crazy huh
Daewoo says: I only watch us tv shows,
Carey says: my point exactly
Daewoo says: some of them are really really good
Daewoo says: like west wing
Daewoo says: heroes too
Carey says: oh, I’m not disputing that they’re good…they’re excellent…
Daewoo says: but?
Carey says: but most uneducated people form their opinions about America from two things…
Carey says: movies and tv
Carey says: and our president
Daewoo says: well, what is he watching?
Carey says: the west wing is great, if only it could be like that
Carey says: Heroes is my favorite show
Carey says: lol, he’s probably watching sesame street
Daewoo says: ok buffering finished watching the video
Daewoo says: lots screaming
Carey says: I scream when I’m passionate about something too!
Daewoo says: yeah, that’s why i didn’t start audio with you
Carey says: so did you hear the whole thing?
Daewoo says: well, did I have a choice?
Carey says: thoughts?
Daewoo says: yes
Carey says: share?
Daewoo says: thought you’d never ask
Carey says: haha
Daewoo says: I see merits on both sides
Carey says: really?
Daewoo says: first of all
Carey says: not me
Carey says: ok, you talk
Daewoo says: thank you
Daewoo says: The America we know today is totally different from years ago. It would be too much to go into detail but I say this; after 9/11 Bush & Company implemented many measures that changed the face of America. You can argue whether it was right or wrong, good or bad, but those measures were carried out by the people. Sure, they were frightened, but still, the problem now is you have only two choices: for or against the government. There are good arguments for being for the government and for being against it. In a time of crisis you have to stand with your government even it it means sacrificing some civil liberties, as long as you agree with it and it’s temporary. The problem is if you are not for the government than you have to be against it. It’s an issue of being a patriot or not, being American or un-American. And in essence I think when you lose faith and trust in your once supported government in a time of crisis or even war, can you/should you turn against it? And can/should you lose faith and trust in your government in a time of crisis? It is understandable to me that people turn to their governments in a time of crisis and put their trust in it. The question is, when is it reasonable to stop trusting your government, especially in a time of crisis? Some people have more faith, others don’t, and the discussion has become so polarized, that you are either completely for or completely against the government. And THAT is the most dangerous part, because democracy is NOT about absolutes but about finding the most common ground. And I don’t see that in America. Comments?
Daewoo says: or fallen asleep?
Carey says: ok…
Carey says: nope, I’ve read every word
Carey says: it’s going to take me a while to respond though….I’m going to do it all at once…so hopefully you’ll be there when I’m done….if not, I will send it to you. So can you give me a little while?
Daewoo says: sure
Carey says: Yes of course, the America of today is vastly different than the America that Bill Clinton handed over to George W. Bush seven years ago. Indeed, seven years ago America had a balanced budget and no deficit. The twin towers stood tall, as much a beacon of freedom as the Statue of Liberty that gazed upon them. On September 11th, the world was forever changed. I’m not going to debate the conspiracy theories that are mentioned in the video, though much of 9/11 doesn’t really add up. I agree with you that after 9/11 the Bush administration implement policies that, under the guise of national security promised to keep us safer. These measures did indeed change the face of America. You state however, that these measures were carried out by the people. I must strongly disagree. If you mean by “people” ordinary Americans from both blue and red states you’re wrong. If you’re referring to the “people” as the elected representatives of our Congress, then you should know that because of the PATRIOT Act, our congress, for the first time in our history, did not have the opportunity to change these dictatorial policies. The “USA Patriot” in the USA PATRIOT Act, stands for “Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism” Act of 2001. Interestingly enough, some elements of what we now know as the PATRIOT Act had been bandied about both chambers of Congress in advance of 9/11, and never generated any interest. Amazingly however, less than 45 days after 9/11, the PATRIOT Act became law, thanks to the culture of fear that Bush, Cheney and Chertoff (the genius we later knew as the person responsible for the reaction to Katrina) cultivated ad nauseum after the attacks. Yes America was scared. You must remember that we have not been attacked on our own land since the Revolutionary War. The experience Europe and Asia had during the major wars of the last century, and indeed the terrorism that has gripped the Middle East for decades, was not something Americans could easily relate to. Add to the mix an anthrax scare (Perpetrated by the government? We still haven’t caught the culprit!), and the coming war in Afghanistan which most Americans approved of, all led to the chaos immediately after 9/11. So, to say these measures were carried out by “the people” would not be, in my opinion, correct. You state also that we only had two choices; for or against the government. It is true that part of the rhetoric that Bush used to start bullying the world, included the phrase, “You’re either with us, or you’re with the terrorists”, in his disgusting Texas bravado. To buy into that rhetoric though would be distinctly UN-American. Our nation was founded on freedom and liberty. It’s not something that people who were born and raised here might always understand. It is indeed what makes this the best country in the world, bar none. It is the reason we have the highest immigration rates and the highest number of foreigners who want to get educated here. Americans do not have to make black and white choices like that, though Bush would like to think we, and indeed the rest of the world, does. While I believe in times of crisis you should support your country and the soldiers who fight on the front lines for its freedom, you do not, as you state, have to “stand with your government, even if it means sacrificing some civil liberties.” This is perhaps where I disagree with you most. Americans fought hard for their “civil” liberties. We fought and won, the Revolutionary War against England, we fought our own Civil War and freed our slaves. We fought for freedom in World War II, and not only saved Europe and Asia, but surely the whole world; had Hitler gotten the Bomb before us. Americans should NEVER have to give up our civil liberties, no matter what. Our Constitution states that, “We, the people, in order to form a more perfect union; establish justice, ensure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare and secure the blessings of liberty, to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.” Part of our civil liberties give us the voice to protest as is done in the video above. Just because we’re not “with” the government, does not mean we are not “with” America. I know that is a difficult concept for many cultures to grasp, but it is the foundation of a democracy. George W. Bush seems to think America is now a “theocracy” where he is the Divine Power. Everything Rosie states in that video is true. Nearly every member of this administration is under indictment. What does it have to take to impeach this president? The answer? A blowjob! I do not support George W. Bush, but like it or not, he is the President. I can object to his policies, I can write whatever I want on my blog, and I should be able to have a conversation on the telephone without worrying that he is listening. To answer your question about when it is reasonable to stop trusting your government in a time of crisis? The answer is when your government breaks the law of the land, the Constitution, which while placing his hand on a bible twice, he swore to uphold. He believes that God has sent him to do this work, and his cronies including Darth Cheney should all be charged for war crimes. I don’t believe in the death penalty, but I wish they would all rot in prison for the rest of their lives. No, democracy is not about absolutes, but when the president does not allow the people to find “common ground” because of totalitarian laws like the “PATRIOT” Act, then we are in a world of shit. This man must be stopped. Two years cannot come soon enough! So…that’s MY opinion! Glad you asked?
Daewoo says: ok, i think there is a misunderstanding here
Daewoo says: well, my fault really
Carey says: what do you mean?
Daewoo says: i tried to lay out, why the “stupid” majority think what they think and kinda forgot to address the “smart” majority
Carey says: ahhhh
Carey says: Lost in translation
Daewoo says: but it was tolerated and uphold by “the people”
Carey says: OK, I will make the proper amendments to our conversation
Carey says: guess who just said hello to me?
Daewoo says: from the smell of it: my brother?
Carey says: your brother! he’s up Looks tired though, LOL
Carey says: you’re mean
Carey says: so now what time is it there? you already had lunch?
Daewoo says: 12:07
Carey says: and we started this at 7 AM? Good Lord
Daewoo says: you are right, wow!!!
Daewoo says: but back to our discussion…sorry
Carey says: no problem
Daewoo says: i agree with almost everything you wrote
Carey says: really? good
Carey says: you saw my profile on my site right? “almost ALWAYS right”
Daewoo says: *no comment*
Daewoo says: im just too polite
Carey says: cuz you know I’m right!
Carey says: polite schmolite
Daewoo says: what was it again? either you are with me or against me? or something similar
Carey says:lol
Daewoo says: i’m just trying to understand how the american people still support the current administration
Carey says: most aren’t
Carey says: a small percentage
Daewoo says: thats why i neglected the “other side”
Carey says: the crazy christians (they’re not all crazy….just the crazy ones, like Elizabeth Hasselbeck)
Carey says: who want the world to end, so Jesus can come!
Daewoo says: oh, lets not go there…
Daewoo says: politics fine, but religion scares me from a certain point on
Carey says: Amen!
Daewoo says: it gets too fanatical
Carey says: did you see “Bible Camp”?
Daewoo says: what???
Carey says: the movie
Carey says: watch it
Carey says: unbefuckinglievable
Daewoo says: politics and religion. thats the most explosive combination there is. never a good result ever!
Daewoo says: as long as it doesnt get mixed, people can believe what they want
Carey says: watch that movie, I’m telling you…it’s scary carey!
Daewoo says: i guess it about brainwashing little kids?
Carey says: yep
Daewoo says: “education” in the name of (any) god! GREAT!!!
Carey says: lol
Daewoo says: hey, i know you are tired and “fading”. if you wanna go to sleep, thats okay
Carey says: yep, I’m gonna finish talking to your brother then hit the hay…I have to get up early to meet friends for breakfast (and it is early already)!
Daewoo says: oh boy. well, sleep well and see you next time
Carey says: ok…have a good day…always good talking to you!
